Hi, I’m using Ableton Live, but it won’t open a .wav file as large as the files I need to open, so I downloaded Audacity for the sole purpose of chopping very large audio files (up to four hours) into multiple tracks for export, and then to open and edit in Live. I can find in the FAQ instructions on how to export multiple tracks. But what I am concerned about is not losing ANY sound quality in this process. The files to be edited are recorded from my Mackie DL1608 mixer and in the specs, it says it uses a 48khz sample rate and 24-bit bit depth. I barely know what this means, but I noticed the default settings on the Audacity track when I imported my .wav from the mixer were 44.1khz and “32 bit float” (it is a stereo track). What does it mean that the track says this? Should I change it to match the 48khz and 24bit depth to preserve my sound quality. Sorry, I just don’t understand these aspects and just want to know how to go through the export process knowing I haven’t sacrificed audio quality.
Also, every time I try to do anything on Audacity, it goes into “Not Responding” mode. Is this maybe because I have a huge file open (around 3g)? If so, it would make Audacity useless as well as Ableton for chopping large files into multiples.
Thanks for any help with this.
What did you record with?
Do those specs refer to the mixer or to the recording device?
The mixer is the recording device. The mixer has a dock that an ipad sits in. The ipad controls the mixer through an app by Mackie called Master Fader. Master Fader has a “Record” function.
I got those specs from page two of this:
http://www.mackie.com/products/dlseries/downloads/manuals/DL1608_SS.pdf
But maybe that doesn’t refer to the recording function.
Also, I found the following at http://www.mackie.com/products/dlseries/downloads/begin_here/DL_Series_FAQ_Top20.pdf
“10.
What AD/DA converters are in a DL Series mixer?
What sample rate and bit depth are used?
The
DL1608 and DL806 use 24-bit Cirrus Logic® AD/DA
converters with 114dB dynamic range (A-weighted) operating
at 48 kHz. These are the same converters as the Onyx Blackbird
and Onyx-i series.”
I don’t know if this adds anything. I’m assuming it records at the same specs as are listed.
44100 is the sample rate of Music CD and 48000 is the sample rate for digital television. Television carries slightly better fidelity way up there where only dogs can hear.
The bit depth is the difference between dead silence and so loud it overloads. Music CD is 16-bit. That’s the Readers’ Digest version.
Audacity internally works at 32-bit floating which is the best you can do. If you do manage to import the file and all you do is cut it up and you turn Dither off, then the exports will have the same quality as the original.
Audacity > Edit > Preferences > Quality.
You may be running into the size limit for WAV files. It can be as low as 2GB, but that’s with 44100, 16-bit, Stereo. Not higher quality files. Are they WAV files?
Koz
Thanks.
So are you recording with the “Master Fader app” on your iPad?
When importing audio into a new Audacity project, Audacity will set the project sample rate to either the default (as set in preferences) or to the sample rate of the audio that is imported, if that is higher. The “factory default” for Audacity is 44100 Hz. If you import a WAV file that has a sample rate of 48000 Hz into a new Audacity project, then Audacity will set the project rate to 48000. If the WAV files are importing as 44100 Hz, then the original file is 44100 Hz.
“32 bit float” is a higher quality format than 24 bit. There is no loss of sound quality when converting from 24 bit to 32 bit. The conversion is perfect.
Converting from 32 bit float to 24 bit will add a tiny bit of noise. To avoid that, go into “Edit > Preferences > Quality” and set “High-quality Conversion > Dither: None”
Note that if you are doing any more than simple cut/delete/copy/paste editing, then you will get slightly higher quality results by setting “High-quality Conversion > Dither: Triangle” (Audacity 2.0.4 or earlier) or “High-quality Conversion > Dither: Shaped” (Audacity 2.0.5 - due for release soon).
After that last post, I called Mackie tech support and learned that in the Master Fader app settings is the option for either 16bit or 24 bit and for either 44.1 or 48khz. All my recordings to date were in the default recording format: 16bit, 44.1. So if I choose the matching options when I export the recordings from Audacity, I’m not changing the audio quality right?
Leave Audacity preferences at the default 32 bit float, 44100 Hz sample rate and set “High-quality Conversion > Dither: None”.
You can get bit for bit accuracy in your files if you turn dither off and only cut up and export the work to a matching standard. The instant you change the work like volume control or filters or effects, you’re dead. You now have a regular sound job and you should turn dither back on according to Steve’s recipe.
Koz
Thanks for the helpful responses. I went in to settings and turned dither off. But now from that I have more questions. In the same place where I can turn dither off it gives me two options I don’t udnerstand:
Real-time conversion – sample rate converter (low to best quality)
High-quality conversion – sample rate converter (low to best quality)
Should I just check best quality on each of these?
Yes, they are wav files.
Yes, I am recording with the Master Fader App. All the recordings I’ve done on it so far were at 44.1 and 16bit. I want the highest quality recordings possible. Since the Master Fader App and mixer give me the option, is there any reason I should not do all future recordings in 24bit and 48khz? And, if I do record at those settings, then after I’ve opened them in Audacity and am ready to export, should I not choose the same options, so that I’m not, for example, converting a 24bit rate down to 16bit on the export?
No. Leave them at the default settings.
Does Ableton Live support 24 bit?
If the final production is to go on an audio CD, use 44100 Hz sample rate throughout the production process.
I always deliver to video systems at 48000, 16-bit, Stereo, no matter what the work. Most video editors are expecting that or something very close to it, and it helps keep the phone calls down. I do that even if I’m producing a single voice track.
If something goes wrong in editing, you do not want to be the one sticking out with the oddball sound track.
Koz
Thanks for the helpful responses. I went in to settings and turned dither off. But now from that I have more questions. In the same place where I can turn dither off it gives me two options I don’t udnerstand:
Real-time conversion – sample rate converter (low to best quality)
High-quality conversion – sample rate converter (low to best quality)Should I just check best quality on each of these?
That ONLY applies when you re-sample (from 44.1kHz to 48kHz, or 48kHz to 44.1kHz, etc.). I’ve NEVER heard any difference converting between 44. and 48 either way, no matter what software I was using or what “quality setting”, etc. Although some resampling algorithms are theoretically better than others, ANY half-way decent resampler should be better than human hearing.
is there any reason I should not do all future recordings in 24bit and 48khz? And, if I do record at those settings, then after I’ve opened them in Audacity and am ready to export, should I not choose the same options, so that I’m not, for example, converting a 24-bits down to 16bit on the export?
You probably won’t notice any difference either way. Theoretically it’s better to record at 24-bits, and if you want a 16-bit file, convert-down to 16-bits later after editing and normalization. The only downside to recording at 24-bits is a bigger file. (48kHz will make a slightly larger file too.) The “pro studio standard” seems to be 24-bit/96kHz.
Audio CDs are always 44.1 kHz, 16-bit. DVDs are 48kkHz. Some soundcards work at 48kHz internally, and the driver automatically converts everything to 48kHz. If I’m making a CD, I record at 44.1, and I generally use 48kHz for everything else.
Thanks for the help everyone. As my first run with Audacity, here is a song I successfully edited out of an hour long performance on the didgeridoo, using Audacity and Ableton. I guess I could have just done it all in Audacity. I didn’t apply any effects in Ableton except some additional compressor. Then I had to open it again in Audacity since I wanted to be able to export as an mp3. Silly that the expensive software can’t open the big file and the expensive software can’t export mp3s, but the freeware can. The effects were applied during the actual performance using the Mackie DL1608 mixer, including some compressor, reverb and delay. The rest is didge chops:-)