USB Vinyl to Computer all sound tinny

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DVDdoug
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Re: USB Vinyl to Computer all sound tinny

Post by DVDdoug » Sun Sep 27, 2015 10:16 pm

I have plunked down at least twice what it would have cost to purchase new albums (CDs) to no avail.
My usual advice is to buy the CD (or MP3) if it's available. :D

Back to the adjustments - You shouldn't need the force gauge as long as the tone arm has a calibrated adjustment and you zero it (float it) first. If there's an anti-skating adjustment, adjust that to match your stylus force adjustment.

Although it's counter-intuitive, it's usually recommended that you use the maximum recommended tracking force for the particular cartridge. (1.5 grams for the Shure M97XE). The Shure brush/stabilizer weighs 1/2 gram (which subtracts from the actual stylus force) so you'd set the tone arm to read 2 grams.

Record can be damaged (and you can get tracking distortion) if the force is too low, and you'll get more wear if the force is too high. But, since you are digitizing the records, and probably not planning on playing them 100s of times, a little extra wear is no big deal.
Many I have tried appear to be scratch free but still crackle and pop too much even after several cleanings.
Perhaps you've forgotten how BAD most records sounded! ;) Cleaning sometimes helps a little, but it rarely makes the record sound like a CD or MP3. With older records there is usually wear & damage beyond dirt & dust, although playing it dirty can cause more permanent damage.
The different effect in Audacity work for some of the cracking and popping but not always. Loud songs cover corrections but more subtle music seems to lose too much of the quality with noise reduction etc. (at least at default setting). Perhaps additional learning time with Audacity will aid in my quest to remove the noise without losing to much of the original track.
For individual clicks & pops, the Click Removal effect is your best bet and you can select a short section of audio so you're not altering the good audio.

Sometimes you can re-draw the waveform with the Draw Tool. But, it's tricky to get good-sounding results, and it's tricky to zoom-in and find the find the defect visually. (Switching back-and-forth between the normal Waveform View and the Spectrogram View can help when zooming-in on the defect. Do that with the drop-down arrow to the left of the waveform.)

For constant hiss, hum, or crackle, regular Noise Reduction is best, but there can be side effects so you sometimes have to decide if the cure is worse than the disease. Sometimes, you can apply noise reduction only during fade-in or fade-out so if there are nose reduction artifacts they will only exist during fade-in/fade-out and the bulk of the song won't be affected/damaged. You can also try that during quiet passages, but "damaged music" during a quiet passage might be more objectionable than during the fade-in/fade-out.

I use Wave Repair ($30) to remove clicks & pops. It does an audibly perfect job on most vinyl defects, and in the manual mode it only "touches" the audio where you identify a defect. But, it usually takes me a full weekend to digitize and clean-up an LP, so my plan is to try one of the more-automated applications whenever I do this again.

This page (written by the developer of Wave Repair) lists several software options and has tons of advice for digitizing records.
It seems that the cartridge picks up every little flaw on my old records.
Well, yes... If it's going to pick-up all of the music it's also going to pick-up all of the defects. There was a "case" here recently where there someone was digitizing 78's and there was excessive high-frequency noise that didn't exist when the records were played on a Victrola. Rolling-off the higher frequencies to more closely match the Victrola's frequency response was the solution, but since LPs generally have (nearly) full-audio frequency range, you probably don't want to do that.

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Re: USB Vinyl to Computer all sound tinny

Post by Shaky » Mon Sep 28, 2015 7:06 am

Do not use soap and tap water!!

Instead as Gale says use a combination of isopropyl and distilled water if you can get it (the evaporation/condensation process leaves practically no minerals behind that otherwise get into the grooves. I normally use a solution of 1 part isopropyl to 4 parts distilled water

One inexpensive mechanical cleaning device you might also consider is this: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Knosti-Disco-St ... B00793YMKK

Alternatively you can find the individual components that make up the kit on ebay, and the essential ones to get are the tub, the central hub, and the dryng rack is also nice to have if you don't have an alternative. Replace the supplied cleaning gunk with the isopropyl solution. Make 4/5 complete and fairly slow rotation of the record, then wipe down thoroughly with a lint free cloth and any static is usually almost gone.

As a final cleaning stage I strongly recommend this software: http://www.clickrepair.net/ In my view it is hands down the best audio repair software on the market - in a new recently improved version - costing less than a 1/15th of 'leading' commercial alternatives.

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Re: USB Vinyl to Computer all sound tinny

Post by cyrano » Mon Sep 28, 2015 11:37 am

If you buy "distilled" water on ebay, you're a fool. It's expensive and doesn't even come close to real distilled or RO treated pure water.

Tapwater is OK if you rinse afterwards with demineralised water. The one or two Ca+ ions left after that won't matter. You can get demi water in most supermarkets. It's about the best you can get as a consumer. Putting distilled water in a plastic jug already pollutes it and makes it worse than demi water. Most of the ions given off by the plastic are very, very sticky.

I've designed water treatment systems for stuff like high pressure waterjet cutters and hospitals. A lot of the consumer treatment stuff is a scam, really.

Real pure water is so corrosive the installation has to be built in reinforced PE. Inox 814 doesn't last six months...

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Re: USB Vinyl to Computer all sound tinny

Post by Shaky » Mon Sep 28, 2015 1:10 pm

cyrano wrote:If you buy "distilled" water on ebay, you're a fool. It's expensive and doesn't even come close to real distilled or RO treated pure water.

Tapwater is OK if you rinse afterwards with demineralised water. The one or two Ca+ ions left after that won't matter. You can get demi water in most supermarkets. It's about the best you can get as a consumer. Putting distilled water in a plastic jug already pollutes it and makes it worse than demi water. Most of the ions given off by the plastic are very, very sticky.

I've designed water treatment systems for stuff like high pressure waterjet cutters and hospitals. A lot of the consumer treatment stuff is a scam, really.

Real pure water is so corrosive the installation has to be built in reinforced PE. Inox 814 doesn't last six months...
Well I have no intention of getting into a pissing contest with you over this, but I feel it might be useful to distill - if you'll excuse the pun - the key points in your jargon laden post:

A. All distilled water purchased on eBay is not real distilled water

B. Putting non-distilled eBay distilled water into a plastic container makes it much worse than demineralised water (also supplied in a plastic container).

Hoookay!

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Re: USB Vinyl to Computer all sound tinny

Post by Gale Andrews » Mon Sep 28, 2015 1:54 pm

cyrano wrote:You'll always need a tiny amount of soap to break hardness, unless you are so lucky to live in an area with soft tap water.
Distilled water should not have that problem - and I never bought it on eBay - it was from Keith Monks recommended suppliers.


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Re: USB Vinyl to Computer all sound tinny

Post by Gale Andrews » Mon Sep 28, 2015 2:08 pm

Shaky wrote:Do not use soap and tap water!!
Personally I agree. I found it near-impossible to remove soap stickiness from vinyl. If you are selling/passing on the vinyl to someone else after digitizing it, it's not fair on the receiving party to use soap.

78's can cope with soap a little better.

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Re: USB Vinyl to Computer all sound tinny

Post by Shaky » Mon Sep 28, 2015 2:27 pm

Gale Andrews wrote:
Shaky wrote:Do not use soap and tap water!!
Personally I agree. I found it near-impossible to remove soap stickiness from vinyl. If you are selling/passing on the vinyl to someone else after digitizing it, it's not fair on the receiving party to use soap.
When I first started digitizing vinyl +15 years ago, I often used lighter fluid, as employed by some of the second hand stores I frequented then - eg Reckless Records in Soho's Berwick Street - to really bring up a new record look shine.

Have recently been re-ripping some of my records from that time because I can now see there is something wrong with the stereo image produced by my old audio card, and I have to clean the stylus every 2 or 3 tracks due to the accumulation of gunk undoubtedly from that lighter fluid. But at least it comes off :D

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Re: USB Vinyl to Computer all sound tinny

Post by cyrano » Mon Sep 28, 2015 4:30 pm

Shaky wrote:Well I have no intention of getting into a pissing contest with you over this, but I feel it might be useful to distill...
Neither have I. Sorry if it came across like that. I get irritated with some of the stuff people are trying to sell to others that are way too expensive. Anything like weight loss, wrinkle removal or other secret snake oil mixes sets me off :lol:

If you can easily get distilled water, use it. If not, don't waste time and money trying to find it if you can get demi water.

Soap is just a question of using very, very little. One drop is enough, literally. And then rinsing with enough demi or distilled water, again, lukewarm.

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Re: USB Vinyl to Computer all sound tinny

Post by Shaky » Mon Sep 28, 2015 6:29 pm

Mr. Tin Ears wrote:the RIAA effect dampened the sound too much, do I need to change the default settings?
If the sound was ok going straight into you amplifier presumably via phono/RCA leads, it sounds like you were suffering from a very basic setup problem on the deck.

Looking at the downloaded manual, on page 3 there is a switch marked 26 (Pre-amp selector switch) -- I suggest trying to flick that and seeing whether the sound improves through the computer without any equalisation in Audacity.

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Re: USB Vinyl to Computer all sound tinny

Post by kozikowski » Wed Sep 30, 2015 2:15 am

it sounds like you were suffering from a very basic setup problem on the deck.
I agree. The shows should not sound odd in normal playback.

I use a solution of 500ml drugstore distilled water with one (1) drop of unscented Dawn dishwashing detergent (not soap). I keep it in a Nalgene® High Density Poly bottle in the closet and I wash things with a plain cotton bandanna. I use name-brand distilled. I got burned with off-brand water. No, distilled water is not supposed to have That New Car Smell. I launder the bandanna by hand, last rinse in distilled and air dry.

I use it on computer screens. Almost all screens are tolerant of water (in moderation). I can do stunning things to an iPod screen with this solution and applicator. The solution drys to zero. No droplets or stains and it attacks fingerprints.

Since I live in Sunny Southern California, Land of Fruits and Nuts, I put a cousin of that solution in a thoroughly cleaned and drained windshield/windscreen washer.

There is a common warning about cleaning electrical contacts with alcohol. You have to go back later and remove the thin non-conductive film that it leaves behind.

Ew,

Koz

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