Audacity Feature

Feedback and bug reports for Audacity 3.0.3 alpha
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Danish-45
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Audacity Feature

Post by Danish-45 » Thu Dec 17, 2020 10:23 pm

Can any one tell me that what are the features of Audacity 3.0.0 Alpha ?

DVDdoug
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Re: Audacity Feature

Post by DVDdoug » Thu Dec 17, 2020 10:52 pm

I believe it's in VERY EARLY development and all of the information is here. I have not tried it but I'm guessing that (so far) there are fewer "features" than the current release.

It looks like the major change will be the way project files are stored. Currently there are many-many small files and it's easy to mess things up if you move a project or share it. The new format should be more robust.

steve
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Re: Audacity Feature

Post by steve » Thu Dec 17, 2020 11:19 pm

Audacity 3.0.0 has almost identical feature as Audacity 2.4.2.

The one big difference (hence the version jump from 2.x to 3.x) is that it uses a new, single file project format instead of the old "AUP" file + "_data" folder.

The new project files have the file extension ".AUP3".

Audacity 3.0.0 will be able to import old style projects, but projects created / saved by 3.0.0 will be in the new format.
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butterfly
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Re: Audacity Feature

Post by butterfly » Fri Dec 18, 2020 6:42 am

steve wrote:
Thu Dec 17, 2020 11:19 pm
Audacity 3.0.0 will be able to import old style projects, but projects created / saved by 3.0.0 will be in the new format.
That’s good news!
The question - will it be possible in 3.0 also to export compressed project? This is important when it is needed to share a project with location with bad internet connection. If this feature is going to stay in 3.0, how the compressed version will look like? Also as single file .aup3 or the old style .aup+_data with .ogg files?

Thank you very much for this amazing upgrade!

steve
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Re: Audacity Feature

Post by steve » Fri Dec 18, 2020 7:56 pm

butterfly wrote:
Fri Dec 18, 2020 6:42 am
will it be possible in 3.0 also to export compressed project?
Not in 3.0.0, though you can achieve some size reduction (sometimes very substantial) by making a ZIP archive of the AUP3 file.

I think you raise a very valid question re. sharing projects, but the old "Compressed Copy of Project" had significant shortcomings. The main shortcoming being that it permanently discards some of the audio quality (another being that the OGG files remain stranded in the project even when no longer used).

You can of course export each track from the project in whatever format you like, but with the downside that if you use Envelopes or a Time Track, these become permanently "burnt in".

Another option is to use "version control" software such as "Git" via a service such as GitHub. This is more complex to set up (you need to set up GitHub accounts), but is a great way when collaborating with others. Each time someone updates the project, you only need to download the difference between your copy and the GitHub copy rather than the entire project. For example, if you and I were collaborating and I just made some tweaks to the track pan / gain controls, then you would only need to download a few bytes to update your version.

I think that there's a lot of scope for developing a really good way to collaborate with projects, but something for the future, not 3.0.0.
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ingoogni
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Re: Audacity Feature

Post by ingoogni » Sat Dec 26, 2020 4:22 pm

Is aup3 SQLite based? Saw something about wal-files somewhere. Would be nice. If so, there's a compressed SQLite format, SQLAR.

steve
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Re: Audacity Feature

Post by steve » Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:41 pm

ingoogni wrote:
Sat Dec 26, 2020 4:22 pm
Is aup3 SQLite based?
Yes.
ingoogni wrote:
Sat Dec 26, 2020 4:22 pm
If so, there's a compressed SQLite format, SQLAR.
I doubt that SQLAR will be used as a working format (Audacity reading / writing directly from / to SQLAR) due to the overhead incurred by compression / decompression. During Record and Play it is particularly important that read / write is as fast as possible.

Theoretically SQLAR could be used when saving / opening projects, and converting from / to a normal AUP3, but according to the docs
"An SQLite Archive is usually about 1% larger than the equivalent ZIP Archive"

Here are some results from a quick test:
project.aup3 - 162.7 MB
project.aup3.sqlar - 116.3 MB
project.aup3.zip - 105.9 MB
project.aup3.tar.bz2 - 75.2 MB
project.aup3.tar7z - 74.1 MB
project.aup3.7z - 54.2 MB
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ingoogni
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Re: Audacity Feature

Post by ingoogni » Sat Dec 26, 2020 6:46 pm

steve wrote:
Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:41 pm
project.aup3 - 162.7 MB
[...]
project.aup3.7z - 54.2 MB
That is a substantial difference.

SQlite is really nice as an app file format. As you mentioned version control. Will Audacity get that over time (Fossil is SQLite after all). "Infinite" redo's are well possible with a database. No history loss after closing. If the files get too big oldest history could be pruned. If file sizes get to big you can continue in a new database and then later attach them. Work with the two or more files as if they are one. You wouldn't have to save any immediate audio result on editing, only just they way you got there. Only render on export.
With the online backup API you could make a kind off multi user version :)

Will the whole machinery around the app file become available as a library? Can it be at all? So other tools can read and write in the proper format. Or, if only to simply extract a WAV file from it (Can always be done manually off-course).

Cheers!

steve
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Re: Audacity Feature

Post by steve » Sat Dec 26, 2020 7:15 pm

ingoogni wrote:
Sat Dec 26, 2020 6:46 pm
That is a substantial difference.
Yes, very substantial isn't it.
I expect different projects will show greater or lesser savings, but after a few tests I've found that 7z compression gives impressive results.

ingoogni wrote:
Sat Dec 26, 2020 6:46 pm
SQlite is really nice as an app file format.
I agree, though I'm aware that not everyone like SQlite. We've been doing a lot of testing to ensure that the format is robust, and it's looking good.

Personally I think that version control and saved undo states are possible for the future, but for the initial release reliability and robustness are the priority. This is a BIG change for Audacity, so I think it's wise to progress with caution.
ingoogni wrote:
Sat Dec 26, 2020 6:46 pm
Will the whole machinery around the app file become available as a library? Can it be at all? So other tools can read and write in the proper format.
I'm not sure, but it IS possible to open an AUP3 file in DB Browser for SQLite and you can, for example, export "Samples" blobs as RAW PCM data.

sqlite.png
sqlite.png (290.76 KiB) Viewed 1149 times
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ingoogni
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Re: Audacity Feature

Post by ingoogni » Sat Dec 26, 2020 10:56 pm

steve wrote:
Sat Dec 26, 2020 7:15 pm
I agree, though I'm aware that not everyone like SQlite.
It isn't the hot thing out there, not the fastest KV store, not the darling of the front end devs and often not understood. But is is a very thorough and solid piece of work. DRH & team and the folk on the SQLite forum are very help full.
I'm not sure, but it IS possible to open an AUP3 file in DB Browser for SQLite and you can, for example, export "Samples" blobs as RAW PCM data.
The thing is, I came here after having a look at the current file format for a little thingy I'm writing. Couldn't find a full spec yet. Open source is nice. Easy accessible open data and formats are better and spawn associated projects. But yes, with some documentation and SQL one should be able to use it.

Thanks Steve,

Cheers!

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