How do I paste into tracks without moving everything?

[Gale Andrews]

Where I see the problem is when pasting and overwriting audio with audio. In this case it will usually cause a "click" at one or both ends of the edit.

This case is the same as copying a selection, creating the exact same length of selection then pasting.

Presumably we could cross-fade the joins?


Gale

[steve]

Presumably we could cross-fade the joins?

The user can do that now if they paste into a new track, but I'm guessing that you mean "crossfade the joins automatically when pasting into an existing track". If that's what you mean, then there's a problem: How long should the crossfade be? In extreme cases the crossfade may need to be several seconds, or no crossfade at all. In more usual cases the best length is likely to be somewhere between 1 and 100 ms, and it is will often be different from one paste operation to the next. There is no way for Audacity to automatically predict how long the crossfade needs to be - only the user knows that, so how does the user set the required crossfade duration while keeping the convenience of "click and paste" ?

[Gale Andrews]

Presumably we could cross-fade the joins?

The user can do that now if they paste into a new track, but I'm guessing that you mean "crossfade the joins automatically when pasting into an existing track".

Correct.

there's a problem: How long should the crossfade be? In extreme cases the crossfade may need to be several seconds, or no crossfade at all. In more usual cases the best length is likely to be somewhere between 1 and 100 ms, and it is will often be different from one paste operation to the next. There is no way for Audacity to automatically predict how long the crossfade needs to be - only the user knows that, so how does the user set the required crossfade duration while keeping the convenience of "click and paste" ?

Presumably default to the same fade length as Effect > Crossfade Clips?

If customisation is needed, presumably an option in Tracks Preferences?


Gale

[steve]

If customisation is needed, presumably an option in Tracks Preferences?

That would not be very convenient for users that need to change the setting frequently.

One possibility that comes to mind would be a separate "Insert Paste with Crossfade" command. That could have a fixed value of say 10 ms, and if some other value is required, then the user would use multiple tracks (as now). Some users win, no-one loses.

[Robert J. H.]

If customisation is needed, presumably an option in Tracks Preferences?

That would not be very convenient for users that need to change the setting frequently.

One possibility that comes to mind would be a separate "Insert Paste with Crossfade" command. That could have a fixed value of say 10 ms, and if some other value is required, then the user would use multiple tracks (as now). Some users win, no-one loses.

It's actually an Overwrite-paste, isn't it?

I don't see the need for long cross fades, at least not at the beginning of the selection, i.e. at the cursor point. It's harder though for the user to match the two ends.
I think a multi-band cross fade would be ideal, such as Paul's de-clicker algorithm, of course in C++ and with a fixed length (optionally adjustable in preferences).
This would ensure that the audio is only modified if necessary.

[kozikowski]

How long should the crossfade be?

In the case of video editors, they only work like that. There's no such thing has a click or pop at an edit point. Of course, you could get into problems needing to edit with finer detail than one video frame, but you can go a very long time before you run into that need.

That's another nasty surprise for video people using Audacity for the first time.

Yet another surprise is a video editing feature I never quite got used to. Overlap two clips on one track and slide the crossfade back and forth blind by clicking and pushing. And then live scrub to see what you did without all that tedious pausing and playing.

Koz

[steve]

Yet another surprise is a video editing feature I never quite got used to. Overlap two clips on one track and slide the crossfade back and forth blind by clicking and pushing. And then live scrub to see what you did without all that tedious pausing and playing.

You've hit the nail on the head. That's how real-time DAWs work.

[Robert J. H.]

Yet another surprise is a video editing feature I never quite got used to. Overlap two clips on one track and slide the crossfade back and forth blind by clicking and pushing. And then live scrub to see what you did without all that tedious pausing and playing.

You've hit the nail on the head. That's how real-time DAWs work.

Those thoughts crossed my mind as well but I didn't dare to bring it forward.
In fact, the overwritten and punched-in clips should be preserved as long as the clip isn't rendered. Thus it would be possible to create handles for the cross fades and the position in general and they could be adjusted by taste.
Of course, those features wouldn't be accessible without a dedicated clip editor... 8-O

Robert

[waxcylinder]

Is there a Feature Request or a Proposal emerging from this?

Peter.

[Gale Andrews]

Is there a Feature Request or a Proposal emerging from this?

To my mind it is a request for "Paste Replace", whatever the internals are about cross-fading. So I will count two votes for that and I think you can archive this.

Gale