AIFF files will not play on iPod, will on iTunes

[steve]

It would be nicer if it fixed the file for you,

That's jumping to the assumption that the file is "broken" in some way, which at this stage I'd say is far from certain.

Apple support say that the error -39 message indicates that the file may be corrupt, but in this case the file data is clearly not corrupt because the file opens correctly in other applications.

Also, the fact that searching Google brings up lots of issues with AIFF files from other well known applications (such as Logic, ProTools, Ableton Live) strongly suggests that the issue is not specific to Audacity.

Try this file, it's just a 10 second beep.
Does it work in iTunes?
Does it work in Peak LE?
Does it work on your iPod?

test.aiff

(861.41 KiB) Downloaded 57 times

[Gale Andrews]

Do we have any direct evidence that Audacity is writing AIFF files that are not compliant to the file specification?

As stated before, if Audacity exports an iTunes-created AIFF file containing NORM and PGAP data, it duplicates the Normalisation information towards the top of the file (but removing the "NORM" designation from both instances) and removes the Gapless (PGAP) information entirely.

AIFF's saved by Audacity or most non-Apple programs will not be identical to those saved by iTunes because of this iTunes-specific metadata.

@audio_pete, I don't think I ever got an answer to this question - if you export from Audacity as AIFF without metadata, then add the metadata in iTunes, does iPod play the files?


Gale

[Gale Andrews]

I have attached what Peak LE says about your files.

error 39.png (585.98 KiB) Viewed 1506 times

Generate a minute of tone or record a minute of audio in Audacity. File > Export as AIFF, do not add metadata. Does that give error 39 in Peak?

Now select the first 30 seconds of that audio and File > Export Selection as AIFF, do not add metadata. Does that give error 39 in Peak?


Gale

[steve]

As stated before, if Audacity exports an iTunes-created AIFF file containing NORM and PGAP data, it duplicates the Normalisation information towards the top of the file (but removing the "NORM" designation from both instances) and removes the Gapless (PGAP) information entirely.

I don't see any reference to either PGAP or NORM in AIFF-1.3 specification.

[Gale Andrews]

I don't see any reference to either PGAP or NORM in AIFF-1.3 specification.

That's why I called it iTunes-specific metadata. My supposition is that if that is missing, it may it make it more difficult for iPod to play the files.

Currently I cannot replicate Audacity removing PGAP on Windows, but it was doing it recently on Mac. I'll have to test more.


Gale

[steve]

That's why I called it iTunes-specific metadata. My supposition is that if that is missing, it may it make it more difficult for iPod to play the files.

I don't have iTunes or any iTunes files so I need to ask.
Is the "iTunes-specific metadata" in one of the standard chunks, or is it an additional chunk outside of the AIFF specification?
In particular, where are these "NORM" and "PGAP" values?
Is Audacity moving the order of the chunks or is the NORM data moved within the chunk to which it was written by iTunes?

[Gale Andrews]

Is the "iTunes-specific metadata" in one of the standard chunks, or is it an additional chunk outside of the AIFF specification?
In particular, where are these "NORM" and "PGAP" values?

The "NORM" is called iTunNORM and like iTunPGAP, it's an ID3 COM comment tag. In AIFF as written by iTunes, these tags are with the other ID3 tags, at the end of the file in the SSND chunk.

iTunPGAP just refers to gapless or not as far as I know.

Here is some information on iTunNORM http://id3.org/iTunes%20Normalization%20settings .

Is Audacity moving the order of the chunks or is the NORM data moved within the chunk to which it was written by iTunes?

When I saw it happening, iTunNORM was duplicated near the start of SSND but the tag descriptions "iTunNORM" were removed from both. The iTunPGAP description and value was removed (perhaps the entire tag was removed - I don't recall).

I've attached a short AIFF, created by File > Export Selection in Audacity, then saved in iTunes on Windows.


Gale

[audio_pete]

I will run requested tests when I get time

You can think what you want
I KNOW Audacity does NOT write out a proper aiff file.

I began with a personal project to transfer 3 cassette tapes to my iPod.
I completed part of that task yesterday when I moved Tommy by the Who to my iPod.
Most of the work was done in Audacity, the final aiff file came from Amadeus.
Today, I completed Crusin' with the Classics vol 6 using the same workflow.
Seems a shame that Audacity does all the work but Amadeus gets the final credit.
That just leaves the Bluegrass tape which I will complete as soon as I get time.

[waxcylinder]

I began with a personal project to transfer 3 cassette tapes to my iPod.
I completed part of that task yesterday when I moved Tommy by the Who to my iPod.

Are you really sure it's worth the effort - you do realize that you can buy the CD of Tommy quite cheaply these days (Amazon US $8.49, Amazon UK £5.94) - especially as your source material is inherently noisy tape

[Gale Andrews]

You can think what you want
I KNOW Audacity does NOT write out a proper aiff file.

We do not know that yet. I think by "proper" you are talking about an AIFF file that an iPod is capable of playing.

It's quite clear that different iPods behave differently on battery or not, with different AIFF files, and with different versions of iTunes.

I know you have tried to help but we do not have clear steps to reproduce anything at the moment.

Please can you answer these four questions - shouldn't take too long.

1) If you record, then export multiple from Audacity as AIFF without metadata, then add the metadata in iTunes, does iPod play the files?

2) If iPod plays the files in 1), is it playing them in the correct order - if not, exactly what do you have to do in iTunes to make that happen?

3) Can you play 01 Amphetamine (2001 Rework).aif from http://forum.audacityteam.org/viewtopic ... 81#p218881 .

4) What is the serial number of the iPod - can you identify it here please https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPod#Models_and_features as to what generation it is ?


Gale