Does Audacity still re-encode mp3 files when saving them?

[Remedial]

I know that in previous versions Audacity would re-encode mp3 files upon saving. I wanted to know if this has been changed. I want to create a mix using various mp3's and would like for them to not be re-encoded, thus degrading their quality in the process.

Also, is there a way to add markers to something like a long mix file in order to generate a cue file for splitting the file into separate tracks? Thank you.

[steve]

Audacity does not re-encode on "Save", and I don't think it ever has, but it does encode if you "Export" as mp3.

Spliting into seperate tracks can be done withing Audacity using "labels" and "Export Multiple".
For more information see http://audacityteam.org/help/faq?s=files&i=split

[Remedial]

Audacity does not re-encode on "Save", and I don't think it ever has, but it does encode if you "Export" as mp3.

Spliting into seperate tracks can be done withing Audacity using "labels" and "Export Multiple".
For more information see http://audacityteam.org/help/faq?s=files&i=split

I meant to say export. Seems like the only program available that doesn't re-encode upon export is Fission. Would be a great feature for future versions of Audacity.

And, when I asked about being able to split files, I meant that, I would like to add markers to a file and create a cue file so that another program could split the file, using the markers, into separate tracks.

[steve]

Audacity works internally with 32 bit (float) uncompressed audio files. This allows Audacity to perform many kinds of complex manipulations of the sound with very high quality. To export without loss, just export in an uncompressed (or lossless) format such as WAV.

Why do you want to split the audio into separate tracks using another program rather than doing it from Audacity?

[kozikowski]

<<<Seems like the only program available that doesn't re-encode upon export is Fission.>>>

I wouldn't fall in love with that idea. I bet the editing tools are extremely restricted to get that non-re-encode process. I can understand cutting and clip placement and global tools like that working, but the first time you have to change the equalization or do noise reduction on a track, it has to revert to uncompressed, do the job, and re-encode. Alternately, if they, in fact manage to do effects like this, they will be restricted to short clips because the computational overhead must be enormous.

<<<I would like to add markers to a file and create a cue file so that another program could split the file, using the markers, into separate tracks.>>>

A cousin to this problem came up in a video forum. How to send time along with a tune. We can all think of very painful work-arounds to force this to work, but there are no graceful, conventional tools that do this--either one. You know that if you do manage to send a Project to someone with "Labels" (not markers) in it, that party will be able to continue cutting. This only works in version 1.3.x and only if you do manage to send a project to someone in good shape, an extremely rare occurrence. It's rare enough, (how rare is it?) it's so rare that I tell people it's impossible.

Koz

[Remedial]

Audacity works internally with 32 bit (float) uncompressed audio files. This allows Audacity to perform many kinds of complex manipulations of the sound with very high quality. To export without loss, just export in an uncompressed (or lossless) format such as WAV.

Why do you want to split the audio into separate tracks using another program rather than doing it from Audacity?

Yup, exporting to .wav did cross my mind, but now when I want to upload that file to my blog or something like that, in order to reduce the download size, I will be forced to re-encode again to .mp3, thus decreasing the overall file quality.

I don't "specifically" want to export using a program other than Audacity. It's just that there are so many programs available that are much easier to use for the average computer user (those of us not using stuff like Audacity) that I would rather direct someone that might download my file (and want to split it) to those programs. Stuff like this:


http://www.macupdate.com/info.php/id/13093/cue-splitter

I use this and it is very straightforward. About two button presses and you're on your way. As much as I love Audacity, I can see how it may scare the uninitiated.

[steve]

but now when I want to upload that file to my blog or something like that, in order to reduce the download size, I will be forced to re-encode again to .mp3, thus decreasing the overall file quality.

That's why it is so important to keep backup/master copies of your valuable work in an uncompressed format.

There are several free mp3 splitters available for Windows, not sure what's available for Mac. But yes you are right, Audacity is not the ideal tool (as much as we love it ) for every audio job.

Other examples of where Audacity is not the best tool: Batch format converting (there are several better tools for this, and Audacity has, in its present version, quite a limited range of supported formats) and MP3 metadata editing (Audacity has the same problem of having to un-compress and re-compress).

[Gale Andrews]

but now when I want to upload that file to my blog or something like that, in order to reduce the download size, I will be forced to re-encode again to .mp3, thus decreasing the overall file quality.

Koz is right. If you want to edit MP3s directly without re-encoding you are limited to cut, copy, paste, fade and other volume edits. For those on Windows, MP3DirectCut is one such recommendable no re-encoding editor (also works on Linux, under Wine):
http://www.mpesch3.de/

For OS X users who don't want to pay for Fission, try Audion:
http://www.panic.com/audion/

MP3s of the same bitrate, sample rate and number of channels can also be
*joined* losslessly with these tools.

While I'm here, there is a similar tool for Windows that can losslessly cut and join OGG as well as MP3:
http://musicutter.szm.sk/musiCutter0.7.1.zip

As for cue sheets, the Audacity workround is to create your labels then File > Export labels (works in stable 1.2 as well as Beta). This exports a text file with the time positions of the labels. There are a few tools you can then use to create a cue sheet from the text file. One is described here that uses Java:
http://audacityteam.org/wiki/index.php?title=Cue_sheets

I know of one or two others but don't have the details to hand.


Gale

[kozikowski]

<<<That's why it is so important to keep backup/master copies of your valuable work in an uncompressed format.>>>

No live sound capture or client delivery is complete without a safety WAV export. If the work is expensive or difficult, I copy the capture WAV files and then lock up the copies.

"I need to post the final on my web site in MP3, and my producer wants to post an Mp4-h.264 on his. One of the mastering houses wants a full WAV (or AIFF, they don't much care), and the YouTube people are demanding a mono mixdown. Oh, and that Audio Producer's gathering in Paris wants Dolby Digital (stereo, thank goodness)."

Not a problem. I'll get all those variations from our archive copy of the client WAV final. It might take me a few minutes. Go get a cup of coffee. Bring me back a Genmai Cha.

Extra honey.

Koz

[Remedial]

but now when I want to upload that file to my blog or something like that, in order to reduce the download size, I will be forced to re-encode again to .mp3, thus decreasing the overall file quality.

Koz is right. If you want to edit MP3s directly without re-encoding you are limited to cut, copy, paste, fade and other volume edits. For those on Windows, MP3DirectCut is one such recommendable no re-encoding editor (also works on Linux, under Wine):
http://www.mpesch3.de/

For OS X users who don't want to pay for Fission, try Audion:
http://www.panic.com/audion/

MP3s of the same bitrate, sample rate and number of channels can also be
*joined* losslessly with these tools.

While I'm here, there is a similar tool for Windows that can losslessly cut and join OGG as well as MP3:
http://musicutter.szm.sk/musiCutter0.7.1.zip

As for cue sheets, the Audacity workround is to create your labels then File > Export labels (works in stable 1.2 as well as Beta). This exports a text file with the time positions of the labels. There are a few tools you can then use to create a cue sheet from the text file. One is described here that uses Java:
http://audacityteam.org/wiki/index.php?title=Cue_sheets

I know of one or two others but don't have the details to hand.


Gale

Thanks for all these great links!! I'm sure they'll be of great help to a host of other folks too.