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small project format

Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 2:17 am
by DynV
I'm not sure if this thread should belong in General Feedback and Discussion but seeing its warning, I think it's better to take my chances here and the mod would move it upon being the case.

I have a file which I ONLY delete in, no single other modification. I'm wondering why its necessary for ti to have such a large save file, a bit over the double of the original. I'm looking for something small in case the exported format need to be something else in the future (perhaps a device (hardware) wouldn't support its CODEC, I couldn't find a player on an OS, ...). I'd like the small format (preferably under 1Mb ; for about a dozen deletions) to be supported by Audacity so the modifications could be done upon opening it but if it's not possible to load/import it, at least save/export it so that I can easily look for the times to make the deletions.

Thank you kindly for your help

Re: small project format

Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:26 am
by steve
DynV wrote:I have a file
What sort of file? An MP3? A WAV file?

Re: small project format

Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:58 am
by DynV
A WAV.

Are project files dependent on the imported audio file? I assume not.

Re: small project format

Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 5:51 am
by steve
DynV wrote:Are project files dependent on the imported audio file?
No, but the best way to cut them up is dependent on the imported audio file.

Ensure that you have the exact version: "Audacity 1.3.14 beta (Unicode)" (look in "Help > About Audacity")
If not you can get it from here: http://audacityteam.org/download/

By default Audacity works in high quality 32-bit float format (twice the size of CD quality WAV) and it creates copies of the data whenever the data changes (so that you can undo the changes).

Are you planning to just trim the audio down to one single file or create several small files?
How big is the file that you are starting with?
What format do you want the final audio file to be?
How long will the edited track(s) be?

Re: small project format

Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 6:24 am
by DynV
I'm sensing you're taking me away from my goal: Having a small project file. That is my #1 priority. I'd rather not have to resort to the following but if push come to shove I will simply make a text file including the deleted section times (from end to beginning to keep the same (original) time reference).

My goal is to take a single file and to make a single one. Most of the time the WAVs are 20-35Mb but sometimes can go up to 70Mb. I currently have Audacity 1.3.13-beta (Unicode), does the newer version have a small project file? I tried an (quite) old version and this one and both version made large project files so I'm skeptical the new one would.

This is alike what my goal would be
[project]
version=x.x.xx
file=folder/filename
[section]
filter=none
begin=hh:mm:ss
end=hh:mm:ss
[section]
filter=none
begin=hh:mm:ss
end=hh:mm:ss
with likely more sections than that and no binary output ; which should amount to 100Kb at most. version being Audacity's.

Again, Audacity loading it (to create an actual project) being optional ; it's generation being the main goal avoiding me to write down the many delete times of the files. I'd rather delete manually using a guideline later than having a large project file.

Re: small project format

Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 1:28 pm
by steve
DynV wrote:I'm sensing you're taking me away from my goa
I'm trying to understand your goal and work out how I may help you.

Audacity Project files are always quite small.
Typically they will be less than 100 KB. Audacity Project files have a ".aup" file extension.
They do not contain any audio data, just plain text and can be opened in a plain text editor such as NotePad..
Here is an example of the contents of a small Audacity project file:

Code: Select all

<?xml version="1.0" standalone="no" ?>
<!DOCTYPE project PUBLIC "-//audacityproject-1.3.0//DTD//EN" "http://audacityteam.org/xml/audacityproject-1.3.0.dtd" >
<project xmlns="http://audacityteam.org/xml/" projname="silence-test_data" version="1.3.0" audacityversion="1.3.15-alpha-Dec 21 2011" sel0="0.0000000000" sel1="7.6373469388" vpos="0" h="0.0000000000" zoom="80.6039416847" rate="44100.0">
	<tags>
		<tag name="TITLE" value="1"/>
	</tags>
	<wavetrack name="Mix" channel="0" linked="1" mute="0" solo="0" height="150" minimized="0" rate="44100" gain="1.0" pan="0.0">
		<waveclip offset="0.00000000">
			<sequence maxsamples="262144" sampleformat="262159" numsamples="336807">
				<waveblock start="0">
					<simpleblockfile filename="e0000f94.au" len="262144" min="-0.899561" max="0.899561" rms="0.394026"/>
				</waveblock>
				<waveblock start="262144">
					<simpleblockfile filename="e0000bb1.au" len="74663" min="-0.710397" max="0.710398" rms="0.29363"/>
				</waveblock>
			</sequence>
			<envelope numpoints="0"/>
		</waveclip>
	</wavetrack>
	<wavetrack name="Mix" channel="1" linked="0" mute="0" solo="0" height="150" minimized="0" rate="44100" gain="1.0" pan="0.0">
		<waveclip offset="0.00000000">
			<sequence maxsamples="262144" sampleformat="262159" numsamples="336807">
				<waveblock start="0">
					<simpleblockfile filename="e0000f94.au" len="262144" min="-0.899561" max="0.899561" rms="0.394026"/>
				</waveblock>
				<waveblock start="262144">
					<simpleblockfile filename="e0000bb1.au" len="74663" min="-0.710397" max="0.710398" rms="0.29363"/>
				</waveblock>
			</sequence>
			<envelope numpoints="0"/>
		</waveclip>
	</wavetrack>
	<labeltrack name="Label Track" numlabels="5" height="73" minimized="0">
		<label t="0.16303855" t1="1.10226757" title="Track 1"/>
		<label t="1.13809524" t1="1.53990930" title="Track 2"/>
		<label t="2.33764172" t1="4.53990930" title="Track 3"/>
		<label t="5.33764172" t1="5.74172336" title="Track 4"/>
		<label t="6.53945578" t1="7.63734694" title="Track 5"/>
	</labeltrack>
</project>
The audio data for a project is typically stored in a "Project data folder".
This folder has the same name as the Audacity Project file with "_data" added to the end.
Data folders are typically very large and may be several hundred MB or more, depending on the amount of audio data in the Audacity Project.
You will find a more complete description of the structure of Audacity Projects in the manual: http://manual.audacityteam.org/man/Audacity_Projects
(The manual is also available in the Audacity Help menu if you installed using the recommended installer).
DynV wrote:This is alike what my goal would be
You can achieve something similar to that by creating "labels" at the points that you wish to edit and then Export the label track.
Label Tracks are described here: http://manual.audacityteam.org/man/Label_Tracks
Here is an example of the contents of an Exported "labels.txt" file for a 3 minute track that is to be edited:

Code: Select all

0.000000	0.986848	delete this
13.653333	25.727710	amplify by -6 dB
40.309841	48.669025	cut
62.415238	74.303855	fade out
74.303855	88.235828	delete
88.235828	98.081088	fade in
121.486803	180.000000	delete

Re: small project format

Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 1:54 am
by DynV
The following is the project file (censoring the folder and file names) I got from an almost 1:15:00 audio file with perhaps 10-15 deletions with no other operation:
... well I can't include the whole thing because it would take more than the maximum allowed per post (Your message contains 66926 characters. The maximum number of allowed characters is 60000.) so I've left only the first waveblocks in case the pastebin entry at http://pastebin.com/DBWSL2uK is taken out

Code: Select all

<?xml version="1.0" standalone="no" ?>
<!DOCTYPE project PUBLIC "-//audacityproject-1.3.0//DTD//EN" "http://audacityteam.org/xml/audacityproject-1.3.0.dtd" >
<project xmlns="http://audacityteam.org/xml/" projname="FILE_NAME_data" version="1.3.0" audacityversion="1.3.13-beta" sel0="388.2293743362" sel1="388.2293743362" vpos="0" h="0.0000000000" zoom="3.0085307223" rate="11025.0">
    <tags>
        <tag name="YEAR" value="2012-01-16"/>
    </tags>
    <wavetrack name="FILE_NAME" channel="2" linked="0" mute="0" solo="0" height="150" minimized="0" rate="11025" gain="1.0" pan="0.0">
        <waveclip offset="0.00000000">
            <sequence maxsamples="262144" sampleformat="262159" numsamples="44176506">
                <waveblock start="0">
                    <pcmaliasblockfile summaryfile="e0000413.auf" aliasfile="BASE_FOLDERFILE_NAME.WAV" aliasstart="0" aliaslen="262144" aliaschannel="0" min="-1.0" max="0.999969" rms="0.173799"/>
                </waveblock>
                <waveblock start="262144">
                    <pcmaliasblockfile summaryfile="e0000fa4.auf" aliasfile="BASE_FOLDERFILE_NAME.WAV" aliasstart="262144" aliaslen="262144" aliaschannel="0" min="-1.0" max="0.999969" rms="0.182194"/>
                </waveblock>
                <waveblock start="524288">
                    <pcmaliasblockfile summaryfile="e0000ca3.auf" aliasfile="BASE_FOLDERFILE_NAME.WAV" aliasstart="524288" aliaslen="262144" aliaschannel="0" min="-1.0" max="0.999969" rms="0.166105"/>
                </waveblock>
                <waveblock start="786432">
                    <pcmaliasblockfile summaryfile="e00006a7.auf" aliasfile="BASE_FOLDERFILE_NAME.WAV" aliasstart="786432" aliaslen="262144" aliaschannel="0" min="-1.0" max="0.939392" rms="0.118595"/>
                </waveblock>
                <waveblock start="1048576">
                    <pcmaliasblockfile summaryfile="e0000d53.auf" aliasfile="BASE_FOLDERFILE_NAME.WAV" aliasstart="1048576" aliaslen="262144" aliaschannel="0" min="-1.0" max="0.895569" rms="0.133549"/>
                </waveblock>
                <waveblock start="1310720">
                    <pcmaliasblockfile summaryfile="e0000bf4.auf" aliasfile="BASE_FOLDERFILE_NAME.WAV" aliasstart="1310720" aliaslen="262144" aliaschannel="0" min="-1.0" max="0.999969" rms="0.165238"/>
                </waveblock>
                <waveblock start="1572864">
                    <pcmaliasblockfile summaryfile="e0000dcd.auf" aliasfile="BASE_FOLDERFILE_NAME.WAV" aliasstart="1572864" aliaslen="262144" aliaschannel="0" min="-0.983368" max="0.932648" rms="0.135785"/>
                </waveblock>
                <waveblock start="1835008">
                    <pcmaliasblockfile summaryfile="e00005ff.auf" aliasfile="BASE_FOLDERFILE_NAME.WAV" aliasstart="1835008" aliaslen="262144" aliaschannel="0" min="-1.0" max="0.999969" rms="0.128584"/>
                </waveblock>
                <waveblock start="2097152">
                    <pcmaliasblockfile summaryfile="e000074d.auf" aliasfile="BASE_FOLDERFILE_NAME.WAV" aliasstart="2097152" aliaslen="262144" aliaschannel="0" min="-0.895203" max="0.951477" rms="0.11609"/>
                </waveblock>
                <waveblock start="2359296">
                    <pcmaliasblockfile summaryfile="e000045f.auf" aliasfile="BASE_FOLDERFILE_NAME.WAV" aliasstart="2359296" aliaslen="262144" aliaschannel="0" min="-0.966949" max="0.999969" rms="0.113626"/>
                </waveblock>
                <waveblock start="2621440">
                    <pcmaliasblockfile summaryfile="e0000643.auf" aliasfile="BASE_FOLDERFILE_NAME.WAV" aliasstart="2621440" aliaslen="262144" aliaschannel="0" min="-0.985718" max="0.999817" rms="0.125586"/>
                </waveblock>
                <waveblock start="2883584">
                    <pcmaliasblockfile summaryfile="e000091c.auf" aliasfile="BASE_FOLDERFILE_NAME.WAV" aliasstart="2883584" aliaslen="262144" aliaschannel="0" min="-1.0" max="0.999969" rms="0.115529"/>
                </waveblock>
                <waveblock start="3145728">
                    <simpleblockfile filename="e0000eb8.au" len="236679" min="-0.980865" max="0.999969" rms="0.128308"/>
                </waveblock>
                <waveblock start="3382407">
                    <simpleblockfile filename="e0000370.au" len="243634" min="-0.864105" max="0.764648" rms="0.089424"/>
                </waveblock>
            </sequence>
            <envelope numpoints="0"/>
        </waveclip>
    </wavetrack>
</project>
I don't see how I can retrieve the deletion times from that. I would like to, so the edition (deletion) archive would be quicker as I have more than a few files to do.

Thank you for exposing me to the tagging method but I hope I can find a way to not have to enter them and simply focus on the deletion. It's already something to go through all the spots I think contain little to no voice ; it's not-so-easy because of the background noises.