Audacity destroyed music after edit

[espec7]

Twice, I've edited part of a track, and Audacity destroyed all music but the edit. However, I didn't see this because visually the entire track was still there. When I played it, there was no sound. When I reloaded the track, it was a straight line until the edited part, where the music was still present. Does anybody have a clue what could have happened? (This has proved disastrous for a full weekend of performances requiring the piece that was destroyed.)

[kozikowski]

Audacity does not always make personal copies of the music while it's editing. Sometimes, it uses external music files and then puts them back. If you move, rename, or delete any external music files, there may be a "hole" in your show. The blue waves on the timeline will not follow you because they are made by a custom graphics file that can be out of step with reality.

A sure way to prevent this in the future is to change an Audacity setting.

Edit > Audacity Preferences > Projects > [X] Always Copy.....

A sure way to get your current show back is to put back that Thumb Drive with all the music you pulled out and put in your pocket.

Koz

[kozikowski]

Export a WAV file of your show to get a single, stand-alone music file with everything on it. Audacity will not "Save" a music file. Audacity only saves Projects which can have this missing music problem.

Do Not do production in MP3. MP3 creates music damage and it gets worse as you go. Use uncompressed or WAV or AIFF files and go off to MP3 as a last possible step before you listen to the music or put it on your iPod.

There's a way to resync an Audacity Project. I need to look that one up. You still need to put your external music files back.

Koz

[kozikowski]

http://manual.audacityteam.org/man/Audacity_Projects

This is an explanation of Audacity Projects.

You still need to put your external music back.

Koz

[espec7]

Thank you for your comments, especially the tip on editing the Preferences to "always copy all audio into project". When does it do this? Does it prompt me for a project name or make a silent copy, and if so, where does it go? I see that even with that preference marked, it still prompts me to decide whether to "save changes" when I exit -- is that something separate from copying audio into project?

****Below that option in Preferences, there was already an option checked to "auto save a copy of the project in a separate folder". I didn't know this was checked. With this option checked, what does the program do -- does it create a project and auto-save it, or only autosave a copy of the project once it already exists ? If it creates a project, where is that "separate folder"? (Of course, I'm wondering if it autosaved that file that was ruined.)****

A few times when I exported audio, Audacity automatically changed the name of the original external file to "[filename]old.wav" without my asking it to. But sometimes not. Any thoughts on why it did that, and why inconsistently?

For the current project I am importing WAV files, editing them, and exporting them back as WAV files. In case it matters, what I did when the problem happened was this: I imported a WAV file, copied a few seconds from one part of the file and pasted it to replace the last few seconds of the file, which added a second beyond the original ending. I then adjusted the tempo of the last few seconds to slow it down, stretching it out a little. After that, without the blue line showing it, the rest of the file in front of that edited section was flatlined.

I hope you don't mind responding once more to these questions-- thanks.

[kozikowski]

I hope you don't mind responding once more to these questions-- thanks.

The elves live for this kind of stuff. However, I'm also trying to get all my Saturday stuff in, so it may take a bit. Since this is a Windows problem, the Windows elves (eight times zones east of here) will be dropping in shortly.

Koz

[Gale Andrews]

@Espec7. Most of this is explained if you could bear in mind the link you were given:
http://manual.audacityteam.org/man/Audacity_Projects

Please look at Help > About Audacity and make sure you are using the latest 1.3.13 Beta. It sounds as if you are not doing so. 1.3.13 is here:
http://audacityteam.org/download/beta_windows

If you use 1.3.13 it will warn you (assuming you do not turn the warning off) every time you import a WAV or AIFF over 30 seconds long and ask you what to do. That is the only audio file import situation where you have a choice to copy in the file or let Audacity read it from source (which means you have to keep the source available).

The Projects Preference "Always Copy all audio" relates to copying in uncompressed audio or not, if this has not been done already, and only the first time you save the project. The first time you save may be when you exit, or may be before you exit. "Save changes" on exit is completely separate.

Example: If you choose not to copy in a WAV in when you get the 1.3.13 warning above, then do FIle > Save Project (without exiting), you will be asked about copying in. Even if you say "don't copy in", you won't be asked again about copying. If you then delete some audio and exit, you will be asked if you want to "Save Changes". If you say yes, your project is saved minus your deleted audio. If you say no, your project stays as it was, with the WAV as originally imported.

The more important Preference to change is on the "Import / Export " section - "Make a copy of uncompressed audio". That way, Audacity will always copy in audio, and you are safeguarded against losing the file even if you just export without saving a project.

Below that option in Preferences, there was already an option checked to "auto save a copy of the project in a separate folder". I didn't know this was checked. With this option checked, what does the program do -- does it create a project and auto-save it, or only autosave a copy of the project once it already exists ? If it creates a project, where is that "separate folder"? (Of course, I'm wondering if it autosaved that file that was ruined.)

If you would kindly update to 1.3.13, that option has been removed - projects are autosaved automatically every time there is any change in the project state. The autosave file is in an "AutoSave" folder here:
Windows 98/ME: WindowsApplication DataAudacity
Windows 2000/XP: Documents and Settings<user name>Application DataAudacity
Windows Vista/7: Users<user name>AppDataRoamingAudacity

The autosave file references unsaved changes to the project, either because you have not saved a project at all yet, or because you have made changes since you saved the project. If you have not yet saved a project, the actual audio data is in the folder given in the Directories Preferences. From your description, you don't need to worry about any of that, you simply brought in a WAV or AIFF file without copying it in, then renamed, moved or deleted the file which prevents Audacity finding it. What you do need to do is FIle > Check Dependencies which will tell you the location where Audacity expects the WAV to be.

A few times when I exported audio, Audacity automatically changed the name of the original external file to "[filename]old.wav" without my asking it to. But sometimes not.

It renamed the original file to "-old1" when you exported over it because you had not copied it into the project. After that point, it then reads its audio from "old1". If Audacity had not done that, it would have been trying to read the original project from a changed copy of the original file.

For the current project I am importing WAV files, editing them, and exporting them back as WAV files. In case it matters, what I did when the problem happened was this: I imported a WAV file, copied a few seconds from one part of the file and pasted it to replace the last few seconds of the file, which added a second beyond the original ending. I then adjusted the tempo of the last few seconds to slow it down, stretching it out a little. After that, without the blue line showing it, the rest of the file in front of that edited section was flatlined.

As above, please look at File > Check Dependencies. If you have a red marked file in that list, that is your problem and you need to put the WAV file back in that location marked in red.

If when you click File > Check Dependencies, Audacity says the project is self-contained, then there is some other problem, possibly a bug, possibly a failure on the drive the WAV files are on. We'll cross that one if we come to it.




Gale

[kozikowski]

When does it do this?

When you Open or Import a music file, Audacity goes about copying the music into it's show.

Natural Audacity, on the other hand, makes a note in the little book it keeps in its pocket where the file is in case anybody ever needs it again. It doesn't copy or move the file. If you do need it again and the file isn't there, that's the hole in the show.

"save changes"

What it means to say is: "I really, really want to save an Audacity Project of the show for later in case you want to pick up or change multi-track or complex edits. This is in addition to the WAV or MP3 mixdown you just Exported. You need to know [whispering behind hand] that I can't save UNDO"

There wasn't room for that paragraph in the prompt.

A few times when I exported audio, Audacity automatically changed the name of the original external file to "[filename]old.wav" without my asking it to. But sometimes not. Any thoughts on why it did that, and why inconsistently?

Which Original External File? The one you were writing to, or the music you brought to the production?

For the current project I am importing WAV files, editing them, and exporting them back as WAV files.

But not the same wave files, I hope? This is a common newbie mistake. Speaking as someone who does this for a living, overwriting work files is an insanely bad idea even though it's logical that you might want that. If anything at all goes wrong, you are crispy toast. No edited show, no work file and no way to get either one.

Given you now know how Audacity normally deals with external sound files, can you see how it's a recursive failure? Every time Audacity needs to play the file for any reason, it goes out and finds it. If you write to it while Audacity is looking for it, that's the end of the opera.

Koz

[Gale Andrews]

A few times when I exported audio, Audacity automatically changed the name of the original external file to "[filename]old.wav" without my asking it to. But sometimes not. Any thoughts on why it did that, and why inconsistently?

Which Original External File? The one you were writing to, or the music you brought to the production?

As already explained, the only time Audacity writes "old" files is if the user exports over a WAV or AIFF file that Audacity was reading direct from the source. So yes, the one he was writing to. It will never happen if you import a WAV/AIFF and your Import/Export Preferences are set to "Make a copy". It will never happen (on WIndows) if you import other formats like FLAC, OGG or MP3.


Gale