Fine grained selection control when editing

[philled]

I'm pretty new to Audacity. I'm using it because I have some WAV files that are on our company's IVR and they have sections which need to be stripped out and replaced with a different recording. I'm having severe problems selecting the _exact_ section I need. I've been struggling with this for over 4 hours now, read some tutorials and watched some Youtube clips, but I'm still finding this incredibly difficult and I'm hoping there's a simple technique.

What I need to do is select the _exact_ section of the existing WAV, delete it and paste in a new section. But cutting out the existing section can't just be "cut approximately around here", it needs to be spot-on to the 1/2 second mark. How do you exert such fine grained control over the selection? I was hoping I could put the cursor in roughly the right spot and then use right/left arrows to get the exact point, but I only seem to be able to use the mouse. Is it not possible to use the keyboard for this sort of exact selection? Even when zoomed in it's difficult to get the exact spot with the mouse unless you have the hands of a surgeon.

I'm also struggling with cursor placement with the mouse. I'm seeing a grey line with arrow heads at either end which appears in the timeline whenever I click in the waveform. What exactly is that grey line for? It seems to get in the way when I want to make slight adjustments to the selection with the mouse. Can I turn it off? Or is it in fact incredibly useful, if only I knew how to harness its awesome power?

What tips can anyone give me on how to do this? As I say, I've so far spent over 4 hours and only managed to edit one file. I have over 30 to do. Audacity is generally recognised as _the_ best tool for doing this type of thing, so I'm desperately hoping it's not actually as difficult as I've found.

[waxcylinder]

For a start you need to turn "Snap To" off -see the bottom left of the Audacity Window.

Very fine grained selection can be aided by zooming in - you can zoom in to see individual sample if you wish.

For fine-grain selection of a large section you may find it easier to locate and mark the beginning and end points with labels - use CTRL+B at you cursor position. You can then select the range between the labels - the cursor will get "sticky" as it gets close to the labels - you will see a yellow vertical line appear.

<<I'm also struggling with cursor placement with the mouse. I'm seeing a grey line with arrow heads at either end which appears in the timeline whenever I click in the waveform.>>
you should also get the grey block in the wavform covering the same span - you can adjust this by clicking and dragging

Have a read of this page from the manual which is currently under development for 1.3/2.0: http://manual.audacityteam.org/index.ph ... _Selection

WC

[whomper]

well.... you can zoom way in - if you can keep track of where you want to be (it seems to wander around the screen when I zoom)

supposed you can nudge the line with cursors
but that does not seem to work for me
(antoher easter egg gotcha that i didnt see in the docs??)

we certainly could use an easier way to find the exact spot to mark whether for labels, cutting, or whatever
-- one that takes a lot fewer steps and alert eyeballs

[kozikowski]

<<<For fine-grain selection of a large section you may find it easier to locate and mark the beginning and end points with labels >>>

I don't do that. I select an area slightly larger than the edit work and magnify Control-E. Then I select and delete most, but not all of the offending clip. Select around the new, shorter work and zoom in again, select and delete more. By the third time, I'm in far enough to edit down to the individual phrases of people speaking and individual notes of a song.

It sounds complex, but with the keyboard shortcuts, it's very rapid.

Once down to zero, you're already zoomed into the edit point to paste the new sounds and you can tune that as needed to surgical accuracy.

Control-F zoom out full
Control-3 zoom out slightly

Koz

[kozikowski]

Each version of Audacity gets closer and closer to Edit Markers instead of Labels. Find your IN point. Press I. Find your OUT point and press O. Delete everything between the two points. Paste new clip.

Koz

[steve]

For a start you need to turn "Snap To" off

Important step that. As in graphics programs, snapping to a grid can be really useful, but if you want to precisely locate a point that is between grid positions you need to switch off "Snap To".

I mostly use the mouse for moving around - Ctrl+Mouse Wheel to zoom in and out. Once you are zoomed in you can use the cursor left/right keys to nudge the playback position very precisely, or use the mouse.

I'm seeing a grey line with arrow heads at either end which appears in the timeline whenever I click in the waveform. What exactly is that grey line for?

The grey line indicates the "play region". Usually the "play region" is the same as the selected section of the track, but if you click and drag on the time-line you can play a section of the track without changing the selected region.

I've so far spent over 4 hours and only managed to edit one file.

So that's 4 hours using a program that you have never used before, learning how to use the program as you go. That's probably pretty good going - your first day using a powerful and complex program and you've successfully achieved something. It gets much quicker as you go on.

Fortunately most of the essential parts are easy to find and reasonably intuitive - in 4 hours you've progressed from almost a total novice to being able to edit your music and you've probably only glanced at the manual, so pat yourself on the back for your achievements so far. Like learning to drive you will get a lot better using it the more you use it, so have a play with it, check out some of the tutorials (see links at top of the page) and have fun. If you get stuck, ask here on the forum and you will probably get half a dozen ways to do what you want and you can choose the method that suits you best.

[whomper]

I don't do that. I select an area slightly larger than the edit work and magnify Control-E. Then I select and delete most, but not all of the offending clip. Select around the new, shorter work and zoom in again, select and delete more. By the third time, I'm in far enough to edit down to the individual phrases of people speaking and individual notes of a song.
...
Control-F zoom out full
Control-3 zoom out slightly

Koz

similar to how i do it
but seems like i have to do a *lot* of iterations
because the selected point tends to move around on screen

[Storer]

Ctl+MouseWheel centers the zoom -- in or out -- on wherever the mouse cursor is positioned. That makes it easy to zoom right to the spot you want.

[whomper]

<<<For fine-grain selection of a large section you may find it easier to locate and mark the beginning and end points with labels >>>

I don't do that. I select an area slightly larger than the edit work and magnify Control-E. ...

Koz

ctlr E ?????

where did *that* come from
i only see ctrl 1 2 3 in the drop down box
plus ctl F and shiftclt F but NO ctl E

needed feature
way to click at the bottom of a drop down box
and see ALL the stuff that was omitted

also someplace (maybe that one exists already) to click and see all the shortcuts in a table to print

[whomper]

Ctl+MouseWheel centers the zoom -- in or out -- on wherever the mouse cursor is positioned. That makes it easy to zoom right to the spot you want.

wow

where did *that* come from ??

seems really handy to know about
thanks !

ps
when i tried it
the screen moved left and right
and i lost the point i was looking for
after zooming in and out and in to get the right level view

that happens with a lot of the zooms andor selects
some coder thinks that the slider bar needs moving
when it should be staying still