Audacity Forum

I've done a little reading here on the forum and the Wiki, so I already know this one has been covered to death. Apologies in advance. None of the fixes that I've seen seem to have helped though, so I thought I'd give the forum a go.

I recently bought a USB turntable, which works fairly well. It came with Audacity 1.2.6 on CD. I'm a long-time user anyway, so I was pretty happy to see that. It records the input without a problem, except for some clipping of the input signal... which is why I'm here. I can't seem to get control of the input level to bring the gain down to an acceptable level using either the Audacity software or the Windows volume controls.

My stats:
I'm running WinXP SP3
On-board Realtek AC97 audio
Innovative Technology USB Turntable (no volume controls)

The 1.2.6 software seemed to have the input locked to maximum volume. When I checked the manual for the turntable, it mentioned the problem specifically and mentions coming to the site to get the latest version. After reading this post, I thought maybe the Beta (1.3.10 Uni) might give me some control of the input level, but it didn't seem to help. I checked for the latest drivers via Device Manager and seem to have the latest and greatest. I've tried both the MME and Windows DirectSound interfaces (both work), with Realtek for playback (works fine) and USB Audio CODEC for recording (also works, as does the Microsoft Sound Mapper setting, Realtek does not).

I don't think this is necessarily an Audacity problem per se, just a cheap on-board audio chipset... but I was hoping you guys might have a suggestion or two. The turntable also has RCA jacks, but unfortunately, my sound card doesn't have any line-in jacks other than the basic MIC in/headphone out.

I think the main problem is that when I go to my system volume control program (basic Microsoft VC), and go to Properties => Mixer Device and select Recording => USB Audio CODEC, there are no controls available... not even a basic master volume (which makes me want to slap the programmers at Microsoft silly, to be honest... lol).

I realize I don't have a top-end rig going here, but is there something I can do to get a hold of the levels on the input side? Perhaps a 3rd party USB CODEC that wasn't designed by Redmond's finest? lol

Any help or ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers...
Steve

Some USB TTs have a gain control (volume control) to manage the level of the signal output via the USB - and some do not - and you say that yours does not. Note that they are not always in obvious or convenient locations - I used to have an ION iTTUSB taht had a gain control underneath and at the back! Have a good look at the device and consult the manual.

If there is no such gain control than you may (and only may) be able to control the level via the Windows control panel - or the driver software for the USB TT may have its own sound control panel.

Otherwise you are out of luck - I hope you kept the receipt and bought from a store with a good returns policy.

BTW I junked my ION in favour of resurrecting my old Technics TT and buying an external ART phono pre-amp and an external Edirol USB soundcard. This setup gave much better recordings than the ION. And note that you can but integrated pre-amp/USB soundcard devices. If you do go this route just make sure that the USB soundcard has a gain control!

The basic problem you have is that when using a USB device like this (applies to external USB soundcards too) the Audacity hands over control of the sound services to the USB device itself.

WC

I appreciate the feedback (pun intended), WC. That's pretty much what I was afraid of. The turntable wasn't really all that expensive, but it'd be a shame to turn it into a paperweight. There are no adjustment knobs or sliders of any kind on the turntable itself... just a few buttons (stop, start and eject). The software CD was ironically labeled "Driver" but contained nothing but Audacity 1.2.6 (Win, Mac and Source versions).

Believe it or not, I actually found a pretty decent solution, and all the parts were right in front of me all along. A little while back, I bought one of those USB deals that consists of an RCA adapter on one side and a USB on the other. Xitel inPort is the brand-name of the little magic box. I originally had the idea to hook up my entertainment center rig to my PC, but I found it a pain in the butt to get the wires across the room (neither the desktop PC nor the modular stereo system are particularly portable... lol). Plus, the software that came with the rig looked pretty amateurish (I had already been spoiled by the versatility of Audacity). In any event, I had intended to find a longer RCA-to-RCA wire to span the distance to make the rig work, but came across the turntable before I had a chance to hit the local Radio Shack.

Anyway, after a quick scan of the inPort manual, I discovered that once plugged in, it would show the inPort as a separate recording mixer device in WinXP, complete with Line, Wave In, Mic and Sum sliders. I just unplugged the RCA cord that I had run to the inPort from my entertainment center, plugged in the USB turntable via its RCA jacks... and the rest is history. It shows up as a "Line" source in Audacity 1.2.6... and is completely controllable and a quick slide to .5 cleared up the clipping admirably.

I appreciate your time, WC... Perhaps at least a little gadget like the inPort might serve as an easy fix for other people that have had similar problems with a USB turntable or other USB device with no volume controls.


Cheers...
Steve

Steve,

the hardware part of the Xitel inPort that you have is a USB soundcard (DAC - Digital to Analog Converter). Does it have a volume control - or is it just controllable through the software sliders?

Are you using it to record with Audacity - or are you using the Xitel supplied software?

I assume your USB TT has a switch to toggle between line level output (which will pass through the on-board pre-amp in your TT) and phono output - you need the preamp to apply the RIAA equalization otherwise the recording will sound thin, tinny and a bit bassless.

Glad you got working - and thanks for taking the time to provide the feedback - that may well help others in the future.

BTW theres a good review of your device on this webpage: http://www.dansdata.com/inport.htm

WC

Sorry about the delay responding. I've been a bit under the weather recently.

To answer your questions, the inPort is just a box, no volume control... The software control works well though. In fact, Audacity's input control works now, moving the WAV slider, so once it's plugged in, I pull up Audacity and off I go.

I found the Xitel software a bit lacking and too simplistic (which could actually be a benefit to some), so I stuck with Audacity, although I went back to 1.2 since I was more familiar with it and didn't want to add any potential issues from the Beta to complicate anything (not that I found any when I tried it initially).

The turntable has no line switch on it, but I assume that the line-level circuitry still exists internally. The TT has separate USB and RCA outputs, so I would guess that the line amp would be hard-wired to the RCA output. my initial recordings are pretty full and clear. The only problem I noticed is that there is a slightly audible high-end "hiss" that resembles the sound of a well-worn album, even with LPs that sound perfect on my entertainment center TT. I attribute that to the cheap construction of the USB TT itself (and the accompanying low-budget needle). In the end, I think I am still bound for the Radio Shack to pick up an RCA male-to-female adapter of some sort so I can go back to my original plan of connecting my good TT to the inPort, which came with a very long male-to-male RCA cable (25'-30'). I believe my main TT has a hard-wired RCA output and it's cable is nowhere long enough to reach my desktop rig and the inPort.

With that setup, I should be able to record music from my cassettes as well, using Audacity to clean up and tweak the sound.

I appreciate all your assistance, as well as the link to the review. It's pretty accurate, BTW... I am very impressed with the sound quality of the inPort itself, but I'd recommend that any serious music fan grab Audacity over the software that came with it for added flexibility and control over the recording process.

As a side-note, I must say that I am still really impressed with Audacity. Initially, I did some rips on some very old vinyl for a friend of mine, which the Noise and Click filters did an awesome job cleaning up (aside from the level and needle hiss problems). It was really like night and day in a matter of a few clicks... and I'm far from an expert on the software. Great stuff!


Cheers...
Steve

Hi Steve,

glad you got it working - and good to hear that the documentation in the Wiki was accurate and useful (one of the other documenters commented recently that we have the problem of beeing experienced users but trying to get into the midset of inexperinced ones to explain what is going on). Thanks for the feedback.

I love Audacity to bits - but I also use a couple of other tools too from a chap called Brian Davies in Australia - he charges a little for the $40 for each package - but they do work extremely well.

See this thraed I wrote on his ClickRemoval: http://forum.audacityteam.org/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=1994

His noise removal software may help you clean up the sound you describe - it's a little trickier to use than his CR s/w but it's worth experimenting with - see: http://www.clickrepair.net/software_download/

Both packages are available on a 21 day free trial so you can easily test if they work for you prior to purchase.

WC

SteveD wrote: In the end, I think I am still bound for the Radio Shack to pick up an RCA male-to-female adapter of some sort so I can go back to my original plan of connecting my good TT to the inPort, which came with a very long male-to-male RCA cable (25'-30'). I believe my main TT has a hard-wired RCA output and it's cable is nowhere long enough to reach my desktop rig and the inPort.

I suspect that you will get much better results with that.

I started out with a cheapo ION USB TT - but soon junked it as it gave far too much wow&flutter(very lightweight plastic platter!)

Instead I resurrected my old technics and gave it a home service and new cartridge - and bought an external ART preamp and an Edirol USB soundcard. MUCH better results with that.

WC