Saved Project Not Playing Back Correctly

[leetuckert]

Greetings:

I use Audacity on a weekly basis editing talk radio tracks. On 2 previous occassions, and now once again, I have had a situation where, after editing the three tracks I work with, and saving the Project, when coming back into the project, the tracks to not play back properly. The third track is working, but tracks two and one only have a few places throughout the 30 minute program where I get sound output from them. The waveform signature is intact on all the tracks, but no sound from one and two, except sporadically. Unfortunately, by mistake, I have overwritten the original tracks. Has anyone seen this behavior? Is there a way to repair this? Any help on this will be greatly appreciated.

TIA

PS: I'm using Audacity 1.2.3.

[steve]

This is usually a result of being too tidy with your computer and cleaning up "unused" files. Computer slobs rarely if ever get this problem. Moral of the story, don't put your toys away until you have finished playing with them - or as it applies to Audacity - avoid deleting or moving any files until you have safely exported your mix as a WAV file.

In Audacity 1.3.5 there are a couple of options in "Edit > Preferences > Import / Export" that offer "safe" settings which will decrease the likelihood of this kind of problem. Audacity 1.2.6 has a similar setting, but I don't remember if it is in the same place, though it is somewhere in Preferences.

[leetuckert]

This is usually a result of being too tidy with your computer and cleaning up "unused" files. Computer slobs rarely if ever get this problem. Moral of the story, don't put your toys away until you have finished playing with them - or as it applies to Audacity - avoid deleting or moving any files until you have safely exported your mix as a WAV file.

In Audacity 1.3.5 there are a couple of options in "Edit > Preferences > Import / Export" that offer "safe" settings which will decrease the likelihood of this kind of problem. Audacity 1.2.6 has a similar setting, but I don't remember if it is in the same place, though it is somewhere in Preferences.

Thanks for the reply. Yes, I was too tidy. I will check out the settings you mention. Is there any possibility of repairing the damaged project?

Thanks...

[steve]

Thanks for the reply. Yes, I was too tidy. I will check out the settings you mention. Is there any possibility of repairing the damaged project?

Unless you can find all the data files that you have moved and/or deleted and return them to exactly the same place that they came from, then it is very unlikely.

[leetuckert]

Thanks for the reply. Yes, I was too tidy. I will check out the settings you mention. Is there any possibility of repairing the damaged project?

Unless you can find all the data files that you have moved and/or deleted and return them to exactly the same place that they came from, then it is very unlikely.

I have failed to communicate the problem. I did not move and/or delete any of the data files. I loaded the three tracks, did the editing, saved the project, and exported the three tracks to .wav files. I stupidly overwrote the original tracks when exporting. I always uncheck "overwrite originals" in the dialog box that appears as part of the export process, but this time, I failed to do that. I loaded the three .wav files in a digital recorder so as to mix them down to stereo applying certain mixdown effects that are part of the workstation. When I began the mixdown process I noticed the errors in the files. I went back to Audacity, loaded up the project, and the tracks sound the same way as the exported tracks. I don't understand what I did that would cause that. During the editing process, everything sounded just fine but, apparently it wasn't, as the exported tracks have the same issue. I never delete the project until I have mixed down the program and created a master CD.

The thing is, this has happened twice before over the last couple years. Apparently I'm doing something to cause this, and, since I have blown away my originals, I'm trying figure out if there is a way to redeem the data. I would also like to know what I'm doing to cause the issue.

Anyway, I appreciate your trying to help...

[steve]

If I understand correctly:

You had three wav files. lets call them "a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav"

These were originally recorded on a digital recorder.

Did you then copy those to your computer hard drive, or did you read them (Import) with Audacity directly from the recorder?(reading directly from the recorder is possible with some recorders, but not others).

You then edited the three files (or copies of these tracks that are now on your hard drive) with Audacity, and everything was fine.

You saved the project (let's say that you called it "myproject.aup").

Audacity then created a file called "myproject.aup" and a folder called "myproject_data"

You then exported the three tracks, but accidentally saved them as "a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav"
Where were these files saved to? Your hard drive or the digital recorder?

I suspect that you may have then made some final change to the tracks and exported them again - but I can't be certain about that.

You then opened the three files in a "workstation" (some other software?) and found that there were parts of the audio missing (silent).

You went back and opened the Audacity project file (myproject.aup), and found that the three tracks in the Audacity project had the same fault (missing audio) as the three exported tracks ("a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav")

Is this about the size of it?
Do not delete or move any files on your computer yet - There are a couple of points that I have asked you to clarify, and depending on the answers it may (or may not) be possible to rescue your project file.

[leetuckert]

See the answers to your questions after each one:

If I understand correctly:

You had three wav files. lets call them "a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav"
--> yes

These were originally recorded on a digital recorder.
--> yes

Did you then copy those to your computer hard drive, or did you read them (Import) with Audacity directly from the recorder?(reading directly from the recorder is possible with some recorders, but not others).
--> I copied them from the digital recorder to the computer hard drive, then imported them into Audacity.

You then edited the three files (or copies of these tracks that are now on your hard drive) with Audacity, and everything was fine.
--> yes

You saved the project (let's say that you called it "myproject.aup").
--> yes

Audacity then created a file called "myproject.aup" and a folder called "myproject_data"
--> yes it did

You then exported the three tracks, but accidentally saved them as "a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav"
Where were these files saved to? Your hard drive or the digital recorder?
--> I overwrote the original files on the hard drive. When had to delete the tracks from the digital record when I imported the edited files back in. Because of this, and the fact that I accidently overwrote the originals on the hard drive, I don't have a backup.

I suspect that you may have then made some final change to the tracks and exported them again - but I can't be certain about that.
--> Nope. I did not make any more changes nor did I do that on the other two occasions this has happened.

You then opened the three files in a "workstation" (some other software?) and found that there were parts of the audio missing (silent).
--> Correct.

You went back and opened the Audacity project file (myproject.aup), and found that the three tracks in the Audacity project had the same fault (missing audio) as the three exported tracks ("a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav")
--> Yes, the same fault exactly.

Is this about the size of it?
--> Pretty much...

Do not delete or move any files on your computer yet - There are a couple of points that I have asked you to clarify, and depending on the answers it may (or may not) be possible to rescue your project file.
--> I haven't touched them and I want as I really need to reclaim this stuff is possible...

Thanks again for your assistance...

[steve]

OK, I think I know what has happened, and how to prevent it in the future, but unfortunately I think that this project is gone and lost forever.

I am less familiar with Audacity 1.2.6 as I've not used it in quite a while, but it is quite similar to 1.3

In Audacity 1.3.5 there are two settings in "Edit > Preferences > Import/Export"
(This bit is different to 1.2.6)
One of them is "When importing audio files"
and the other is "when saving a project"
each of these has a "safe" and a "fast" option.
By default, Audacity uses the faster option.
(In Audacity 1.2.6, the first of these options is in "Edit > Preferences > File Formats" - I'm not sure where the other option is, if indeed it has it).

When using the faster option, Audacity uses the actual files that you import as the data in the project (your files "a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav").

Also, when saving the project, it does not copy the data to the data folder. Instead, the Audacity project file ("myproject.aup") points to the data in the original files ("a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav").

The problem here is that by overwriting the files "a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav", you have changed the data that the project is using, thus the project is broken. If you still had the original files on your digital recorder, you may have had a chance to replace "a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav" with the originals and get your project back, but even then there is no guarantee that it would have worked because Audacity projects are notoriously fickle if you start messing with the data.

I would strongly recommend that you upgrade to 1.3.5, because it is far superior to 1.2.6 in many ways (unfortunately it is not completely bug free, but I believe it is pretty stable on Windows - if you need a very stable and bug free version for Windows, get Audacity 1.3.4)

Then set the "Import/Export" settings to "Safe". This then means that you are always working on a copy of the imported files, and when you save a project, all the data used in the project is copied to the data folder. Importing audio, and saving projects is slower, but it makes it a bit more difficult to mess up your project.

[leetuckert]

OK, I think I know what has happened, and how to prevent it in the future, but unfortunately I think that this project is gone and lost forever.

I am less familiar with Audacity 1.2.6 as I've not used it in quite a while, but it is quite similar to 1.3

In Audacity 1.3.5 there are two settings in "Edit > Preferences > Import/Export"
(This bit is different to 1.2.6)
One of them is "When importing audio files"
and the other is "when saving a project"
each of these has a "safe" and a "fast" option.
By default, Audacity uses the faster option.
(In Audacity 1.2.6, the first of these options is in "Edit > Preferences > File Formats" - I'm not sure where the other option is, if indeed it has it).

When using the faster option, Audacity uses the actual files that you import as the data in the project (your files "a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav").

Also, when saving the project, it does not copy the data to the data folder. Instead, the Audacity project file ("myproject.aup") points to the data in the original files ("a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav").

The problem here is that by overwriting the files "a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav", you have changed the data that the project is using, thus the project is broken. If you still had the original files on your digital recorder, you may have had a chance to replace "a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav" with the originals and get your project back, but even then there is no guarantee that it would have worked because Audacity projects are notoriously fickle if you start messing with the data.

I would strongly recommend that you upgrade to 1.3.5, because it is far superior to 1.2.6 in many ways (unfortunately it is not completely bug free, but I believe it is pretty stable on Windows - if you need a very stable and bug free version for Windows, get Audacity 1.3.4)

Then set the "Import/Export" settings to "Safe". This then means that you are always working on a copy of the imported files, and when you save a project, all the data used in the project is copied to the data folder. Importing audio, and saving projects is slower, but it makes it a bit more difficult to mess up your project.

Thanks for your help on this. I've made the changes you suggested. I will also try to upgrade Audacity as soon as possible. The problem now is to determine if I made a backup disk of the program when we recorded it. I think I did, but I will have travel for about an hour to search for it. Again, thanks for all you assistance on this...

[leetuckert]

OK, I think I know what has happened, and how to prevent it in the future, but unfortunately I think that this project is gone and lost forever.

I am less familiar with Audacity 1.2.6 as I've not used it in quite a while, but it is quite similar to 1.3

In Audacity 1.3.5 there are two settings in "Edit > Preferences > Import/Export"
(This bit is different to 1.2.6)
One of them is "When importing audio files"
and the other is "when saving a project"
each of these has a "safe" and a "fast" option.
By default, Audacity uses the faster option.
(In Audacity 1.2.6, the first of these options is in "Edit > Preferences > File Formats" - I'm not sure where the other option is, if indeed it has it).

When using the faster option, Audacity uses the actual files that you import as the data in the project (your files "a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav").

Also, when saving the project, it does not copy the data to the data folder. Instead, the Audacity project file ("myproject.aup") points to the data in the original files ("a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav").

The problem here is that by overwriting the files "a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav", you have changed the data that the project is using, thus the project is broken. If you still had the original files on your digital recorder, you may have had a chance to replace "a.wav", "b.wav" and "c.wav" with the originals and get your project back, but even then there is no guarantee that it would have worked because Audacity projects are notoriously fickle if you start messing with the data.

I would strongly recommend that you upgrade to 1.3.5, because it is far superior to 1.2.6 in many ways (unfortunately it is not completely bug free, but I believe it is pretty stable on Windows - if you need a very stable and bug free version for Windows, get Audacity 1.3.4)

Then set the "Import/Export" settings to "Safe". This then means that you are always working on a copy of the imported files, and when you save a project, all the data used in the project is copied to the data folder. Importing audio, and saving projects is slower, but it makes it a bit more difficult to mess up your project.

You were absolutely correct in your analysis of the problem. By the Providence of GOD, I discovered that the digital workstation on which I work has the ability to "undo" up to the last 15 operations on a "song". I was able to undo my erasure of the three tracks when replacing them with the edited tracks. After restoring the tracks with undo, I exported the tracks to the notebook and loaded up the saved project. With the proper files in place, the project data worked perfectly. I simply re-exported the tracks to different file names, reloaded the data into the digital unit, and all was well. So, I was able to create the masters and no one is going to be upset with me

Thanks again for all the assistance...